Initial Costs?

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OnionChutney
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Initial Costs?

Post by OnionChutney »

Chuck2 wrote:
Thu Jul 08, 2021 8:05 am

1. If you are replacing floor, ceiling, refinishing walls, installing insulation, adding/ replacing Windows, adding interior of walls. I would say the starting price is 10man yen per m2. And this is not including tax.
This is great info, thanks. Pricey, but great info!
Chuck2 wrote:
Thu Jul 08, 2021 8:05 am

There is also, two Japanese government, House renovation programs currently available to home owners. We are using both of them on our current renovation. One is a point system and you get gifts like camping gear the other is cash back. By using this system we were able to beef up our insulation and go triple glazed windows for the same price as double glazed.
Now THIS sounds good to me. Do you have any links?
If the house does crumble in a few years, at least I'll have the camping gear to live in the forest...
We think we've found our house in the countryside near Munakata City, but we want to be sure!

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Chuck2
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Post by Chuck2 »

@OnionChutney here is a link to the point system program
https://eco-po.com/about

And here the dannetsu renovation program. This program has a set budget, so once it is met they stop taking applications for the year. You might not be able to use it this year anymore. Application starts in May of each year.


https://sii.or.jp/moe_material02/

Hope this helps

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DocDoesFarming
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Initial Costs?

Post by DocDoesFarming »

edmundedgar wrote:
Wed Jul 07, 2021 8:58 pm

We put in a complete concrete layer under the house to keep out the damp, but we could only do that because we also ripped out the entire floor. Otherwise you may be able to stuff some plastic sheeting down there which is cheap but I'm not sure how effective.
Sorry for hijacking the thread.
How did you go about doing the concrete, was that something you did yourself? And is it just a case of making a mix and just pouring it in?
Also what are the actual benefits for it other than keeping out the damp?
I write a load of bollocks, don't take me seriously.

edmundedgar
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Post by edmundedgar »

DocDoesFarming wrote:
Thu Jul 08, 2021 8:37 pm
edmundedgar wrote:
Wed Jul 07, 2021 8:58 pm

We put in a complete concrete layer under the house to keep out the damp, but we could only do that because we also ripped out the entire floor. Otherwise you may be able to stuff some plastic sheeting down there which is cheap but I'm not sure how effective.
Sorry for hijacking the thread.
How did you go about doing the concrete, was that something you did yourself? And is it just a case of making a mix and just pouring it in?
Also what are the actual benefits for it other than keeping out the damp?
We only did it for the damp, I'm not sure if it has any other benefits.

We didn't do any of it ourselves, the builder hired a professional concrete person who scraped at the ground with a mechanical digger to get it flat then put down gravel, then a metal frame, then concrete.



PS In sad related news, I heard that the second house built by the person who built ours has had its unique heavily-watered doma living room concreted...
http://www.michaelfreemanphoto.com/medi ... kura-house

Tora
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Post by Tora »

The concrete is for moisture and also termites (in theory)
It doesn’t need to be thick. I don’t think it would be impossible to do it without removing the floors but I think it would be extremely unpleasant. I doubt a professional would do it for less than a billion yen. You could diy it I guess. You would need a few people- preferably motivated teenagers or strong short people to bring buckets of concrete (mixed outside) into and under the house.

We used plastic but I sometimes think a major problem for out location is not just the moisture coming out of the soil but the hot damp air flowing under our house and causing condensation when it is cooled under the house. I asked a carpenter friend about a few options and he said the best solution he’s seen is subfloor ventilation. So I made a couple subfloor exhaust fans from some ¥2000 pit toilet exhaust fans and some 100mm plumbing pipe elbows. They run 24/7. It works ok but there is still a lot of moisture in our humid valley and I still wonder if there’s a better way.

That being said, we concreted over the area that used to be the old pit toilet under our current toilet and I notice no moisture issues there in contrast to an area 1 meter away on the same end of the house that was not concreted over. That room has major moisture issues and needs a dehumidifier running in the humid months.

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Chuck2
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Post by Chuck2 »

DocDoesFarming wrote:
Thu Jul 08, 2021 8:37 pm
Sorry for hijacking the thread.
How did you go about doing the concrete, was that something you did yourself? And is it just a case of making a mix and just pouring it in?
Also what are the actual benefits for it other than keeping out the damp?
We noticed the area were we first renovated has a lot of crickets living under the floor were we didn't lay concrete.

Our current renovation we just layed concrete, here are some pictures of it and some before pictures. Sorry order is all gushagusha!

In one of the pictures you can see the concrete in the foreground with metal supports supporting the floor and in the background there are metal supports on top of square concrete blocks. Pouring concrete is a little less work for the carpenters would be another small benefit.


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e2a:
pictures rather than links. ZN

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DocDoesFarming
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Post by DocDoesFarming »

Thanks for the replies people.

Christ that looks like a job way out of my league looking at all the pictures.
I suppose I could go for the cheaper option of just doing sheeting considering we don't actually own the house but renting it. The owners said we could do pretty much anything we wanted or needed to do but I don't fancy chucking loads of money at this house for his son years down the road to kick us out or whatever.
I write a load of bollocks, don't take me seriously.

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Post by Tora »

DocDoesFarming wrote:
Fri Jul 09, 2021 8:20 pm
Thanks for the replies people.

Christ that looks like a job way out of my league looking at all the pictures.
I suppose I could go for the cheaper option of just doing sheeting considering we don't actually own the house but renting it. The owners said we could do pretty much anything we wanted or needed to do but I don't fancy chucking loads of money at this house for his son years down the road to kick us out or whatever.
When we did the plastic sheeting, we used the thick plastic (“doma shiito”) sold at the pro level home center. It’s usually used under concrete foundation slabs and is probably the stuff in the pics posted above. Thinner stuff would work but you’ll put lots of holes in it crawling about on it. I think I payed about ¥5000 for a 2m x 50m roll. I’ll check the thickness next time I go shopping. Maybe 0.1mm?

We sealed the sheets together with double sided “kimitsu tape”. It’s stocked near the tyvek and asphalt roofing in the Konan Pro. Other tape might work but that kimitsu tape seemed to stick the best. Wipe the plastic sheet with a well wrung cloth where you plan to apply the tape or it won’t stick. I wasted a lot of expensive tape before I figured that one out. I think the plastic has oil or other residue on it from the factory. Cut plastic to length, apply the tape, and roll it up above the floor or outside. Doing it under the floor makes the job unnecessarily unpleasant.

This job goes pretty smoothly with 2-3 people. It’s pretty cool under the house in summer too.

If you want a cheap and supposedly effective termite spray recipe that it supposedly harmless to humans, let me know and I’ll look fo it. Basically boron based.

Subfloor fans really make a big difference too. I put 2 in for ¥5-6000, a little work, and ingenuity.

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Post by Ibaraki llama »

Most of what I would add has been covered well by others.

We already had a concrete base so we just needed to take care of the wood. It's not a fun job but you can do it cheaply yourself by buying the termite paint and getting under the house with a brush.

Earthquake resistance as much as can be done realistically, as mentioned, ply on key structural walls, new walls/existing walls that are accessible cross-braced and also the metal corner braces, doubling up existing key structural support posts. All that isn't too expensive and if you're hiring a carpenter who knows what they're doing can be done relatively cheaply and easily.

As suggested, find an (older) independent carpenter who has good experience on old houses, who will probably have good connections to other contractors they've worked with for a long time who will also be on the cheaper side. But better to get recommendations or see their work as, like other places in the world, quality can vary. If you're going directly with a carpenter you might want to hire an independent architect (around 10% of project cost) who can liaise between you and the carpenter if you don't have much experience, as they can also explain better what you want, and can help direct the carpenter. They'll also know what reasonable prices should be when you're getting quotes. An independent carpenter may need quite a bit of direction if you have a specific design/idea in mind. But if it's a simple renovation it may not be necessary.

OnionChutney
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Post by OnionChutney »

Ibaraki llama wrote:
Mon Jul 12, 2021 10:43 am

As suggested, find an (older) independent carpenter who has good experience on old houses, who will probably have good connections to other contractors they've worked with for a long time who will also be on the cheaper side.
This is exactly the route I want to take. Now I've just got to find out where all these old carpenters are hiding...
We think we've found our house in the countryside near Munakata City, but we want to be sure!